http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450 The NewsBiscuit Community en-US Sun, 19 May 2013 05:18:42 +0000 http://bbpress.org/?v=1.0.2 q http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/search.php http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-4181 Fri, 26 Mar 2010 00:37:33 +0000 Quaz 4181@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Don't think we are US bashing here Rikkor, don't want to push so called "socialism" (in the UK now? ha!), just baffled at how the US anti-healthcare lobby has made up so so many lies about the UK system and sold them to so many. It's not even as though you'll end up with anything like the NHS, seems to me it's just going to be a govt sponsored insurance scheme using the existing private healthcare system. British Rightwingers would love to do that here, and I wouldn't be suprised if we end up moving that way (might even be the way to go if the US can make a go of it).</p> <p>I just haven't heard any cogent argument from the US right against healthcare reform that doesn't involve a bunch of made up scare stories about 'death panels' or some such rubbish, and nothing they say recognises that you can still pay for healthcare if you can or want to. I would genuinely like to hear the real reasoning, but I suspect it's just "it smacks of socialism", and there is no argument against that one to the US right. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-4147 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 20:03:40 +0000 PluckyMunky 4147@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Writing as a nurse, Mr Umpire, that ain't best practice. But hopefully there are more 'good' stories of care than this outlier. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-4146 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 19:58:30 +0000 theumpire 4146@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Can I tell you about my NHS experience this week?</p> <p> When I was attending my local health centre to have the stitches removed from my knee, the nurse tore open a prepacked, sterile pair of forceps (to her, tweezers to you and me) to raise the stitches, then cut them with the scissors which were lying on her desk.</p> <p>Once this was done, she gave me the tweezers, saying that they would only be thrown away if I didn't want them! They are made from high quality stainless steel. But why, I ask myself, if they are only "one use then discard"? Surely the NHS could save some money here; or perhaps the real solution would be to start using sterilized, pre-packed, one use scissors as well? </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-4138 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 19:27:47 +0000 PluckyMunky 4138@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>amen, ram, bro </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-4129 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 19:02:33 +0000 ramblesid 4129@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Perhaps you should stick to the knob gags then </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-4125 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 18:50:36 +0000 the coarse whisperer 4125@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>I came here for the knob gags not for an ideological set-to, but I would like to say one thing. It's exasperating the way the debate has been framed (on both sides of the Atlantic) that there is a dichotomy between entirely tax funded, free at the point of use, provision and wholly insurance funded health care when every other industrialised country has a mixed economy that seems to work a lot more efficiently than either. As the old saw goes, if the NHS is so wonderful why does no other country copy it? Now that someone has maybe they'd like to answer how you can have redistribution without rationing? </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-4081 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 15:54:29 +0000 Scroat 4081@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p><blockquote>I was trying to be nice and stop.</blockquote></p> <p>Well done Nyles. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-4041 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:17:27 +0000 ramblesid 4041@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Sorry John, please don't mind me, it was a joke. I found the idea of someone working just to pay tax amusing. As long as you're not on the board of a bank or building society you're ok by me.<br /> You assume a huge amount about what Rikkor knows and how myself and other readers would judge an argument with a counter view to our own.<br /> When I challenged him to a debate I didn't bother to think of any arguments for or against because I knew I wouldn't get one. I expected either no response or what he's done: blindly lashing out with the insults.<br /> There's a lot in the States who, when the word socialism is whispered in their ear immediately start flapping around squawking "The British are coming!"<br /> The American healthcare system doesn't concern me. It's their health and they can do anything they want with it. I don't, though, like the way the faults in our system are being picked out and used, by those with a vested interest, as examples why they shouldn't have anything to do with such an idea.<br /> They could be looking at those faults as a way of making sure they don't make the same mistakes as us. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-4003 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 09:47:31 +0000 John Square 4003@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>We post those on the BBC Writer's room forum </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-4002 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 09:45:41 +0000 MADJEZ 4002@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>This is all getting very heavy going having you lot got knob-gags to go home to. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-4001 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 09:38:08 +0000 John Square 4001@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p><blockquote> Mr Square, who works in a Qango like off-shoot of the working world which only pays tax without receiving any pay,</blockquote></p> <p>Sid, I know that this is a major bee in your bonnet, so, for clarity:</p> <p>I have a job. I pay tax. I do not recieve money from the public purse as part of my salary. And it's not a quango- it's social housing. I work for a charity that puts people who have nowhere to live, or cannot afford to buy and rent on the open market in homes. One might say I work in the guts of a social(ist) service. </p> <p><blockquote> We just don't understand what the Yanks have a problem with. Rather than have this primitive outcry of "it's Socialism therefore it's wrong" how about a rational argument Rikkor? Perhaps Dumbnews could join in as well.</blockquote></p> <p>It might be that: </p> <p>a)Rikkor knows any rational argument in favour of us-style healthcare he puts forth would be viewed as irrational by those of us who have always had the NHS at our beck and call, for those moments when we need to be parked on a trolley in a hospital corridor. </p> <p>b)that Rikkor (or anyone who hasn't had a national health service before) views our refusal to admit any other system may have its merits as fundamentally irrational, and thus not worth arguing with.</p> <p>I think both systems have their merits and problems. These can be summarised thus: In the US some people don't get prompt, good quality, free medical attention, but the better off people do. In the UK some people don't get prompt, good quality, free medical attention, but the better off people do. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3998 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 09:32:17 +0000 Scroat 3998@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Don't want to cloud the issue but many people seem to think black or white, NHS or private. There many shades of grey, the most important being that people often start off with the NHS but elect to go private for treatment if they can afford it, either to avoid waiting or to have a more comfortable ward if a stay in hospital is involved. And of course all sorts of medics – from nursing staff to surgeons – operate in both sectors. </p> <p>So it is in many ways self regulating as those with money can choose to crossover if they wish. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3996 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 09:21:35 +0000 Oxbridge 3996@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Just how do the septics define 'socialism' Rikkor? We used to have a vaguely socialist party, that's why I joined it, only now it's joined the other two main British parties on the centre-right. Admittedly all three are way to the left of Obama, never mind the nutcases who regard him as a dangerous lefty. Strange world. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3972 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 07:08:26 +0000 StoopyDeGunt 3972@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Rikkor,</p> <p>I agree.</p> <p>People who just post negative comments all the time, without contributing much themselves, are tedious.</p> <p>Or, beyond lame, as you might say. </p> <p>Its a good thing you guys had that revolution, or you'd be speaking English now. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3969 Thu, 25 Mar 2010 06:25:44 +0000 Doctor Jalapeno 3969@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Can you still get health care if you are not very well to start with - or do they run with the BUPA model where they only really want healthy people on board. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3958 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 23:37:16 +0000 rikkor 3958@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>I was trying to be nice and stop. But, here's my last volley: </p> <p>You were all forced into a post-war system that once worked, but now does not. It is impossible for you to do anything about it, so you shut up, or grumble quietly among yourselves. </p> <p>It drives you absolutely batshit that some folks in your socialist utopia have the $$$ to buy themselves better care. But, you can't say that out loud either, as it would make you feel even more impotent. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3935 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 21:24:15 +0000 ramblesid 3935@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>It seems as though all The British contributors to the argument, apart from Mr Square, who works in a Qango like off-shoot of the working world which only pays tax without receiving any pay, are in general agreement. We just don't understand what the Yanks have a problem with. Rather than have this primitive outcry of "it's Socialism therefore it's wrong" how about a rational argument Rikkor? Perhaps Dumbnews could join in as well. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3912 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 20:16:38 +0000 The All New Jeni B 3912@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>I know we have a number of "Drs" on here, but are any of you Medical docs, and can give us an insiders perspective? </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3909 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 20:10:27 +0000 PluckyMunky 3909@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>the consultant at the local NHS hospital was one and a half hours late in seeing me today. i reflected on some of the issues raised on this board. i realised that a) i was guaranteed professional health care, despite the delay, b) no-one would give me private health insurance, if i wanted it, which i don't and c) most people in the world (including huge numbers in the US), just don't have my privilege of seeing an expert on a particular disorder, without first showing a credit card or facing a bill. </p> <p>What, exactly, are the arguments AGAINST giving people healthcare? </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3894 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 18:50:22 +0000 Scroat 3894@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p><blockquote>anyone who wants the 100 million + Americans who aren't rich and white to get healthcare is obviously an America-hating commie scum who must die</blockquote></p> <p>This sums it up exactly Oxo. It buggers belief. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3884 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 17:27:05 +0000 PluckyMunky 3884@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>you don't mean enema bunton, do you? </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3883 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 17:24:22 +0000 The All New Jeni B 3883@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>*Snaps fingers* That's the one Scroat. Sounds like she's got a rubber pipe up her Orinoco Flow? </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3880 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 17:02:20 +0000 Scroat 3880@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>I think you're getting Ennui confused with Enema, Jeni. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3879 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 17:01:50 +0000 malgor 3879@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Do US servicemen, injured fighting in Afghanistan, have their healthcare costs docked from their wages? </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3876 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 16:55:07 +0000 Scroat 3876@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>And some of the people voting against it are the ones who stand to benefit.</p> <p>The country is completely bonkers. Either that or we're all Liberal anti-American pinkos, or something. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3875 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 16:50:09 +0000 Scroat 3875@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>You don't mean the French drama queen Jean Ennui...</p> <p>I've got it - the French tennis player Ennui Leconte. Qui? </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3865 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 16:26:55 +0000 The All New Jeni B 3865@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>No, not Thierry Ennui, it's the Irish singer what's other siblings made up Clannad. She sang a song about one of the Wombles. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3862 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 16:21:55 +0000 Oxbridge 3862@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Yup, anyone who wants the 100 million + Americans who aren't rich and white to get healthcare is obviously an America-hating commie scum who must die. </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3855 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 15:57:14 +0000 Scroat 3855@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Oh no - not that Thierry Ennui..? </p> http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/topic.php?id=1450#post-3852 Wed, 24 Mar 2010 15:49:34 +0000 rikkor 3852@http://newsbiscuit.com/forum/ <p>Ennui all getting a bit boring? Time to move on. </p>